To help you hammer those deals, sales figures for BMW for October:
“There’s no question the U.S. is becoming a tougher sales market, so for BMW to mark 12 straight months of sales gains in the U.S. is a solid accomplishment,” said Bernhard Kuhnt, President and CEO, BMW of North America. “With only two months remaining in the year, November is important for BMW as the all-new and much anticipated X5 will go on sale, joining the very popular X3 in the marketplace.”
Interesting…fail to see how this helps anyone hammer out a deal though.
Interesting. I can see how this info may suggest that BMW might increase incentives in December to ensure a year over year sales increase. But who knows with BMW - note that Mini sales have dropped like a rock – yet BMWFS ended lease support for 2018 Minis in November, which is nuts b/c lots of 2018s still on the lot.
That’s what everyone hope is, so when you get a quote which you don’t like - you can respond with “Ok, I will talk to you in December” 
You also run the risk of nothing changing, or even getting worse by waiting…and that car you were holding out on could be gone.
It’s always a roll of the dice. How much of a risk is it to you is the question everyone should ask.
Well, in my case the target is BMW X2, it’s a hard sell and dealers know it (too small for Walmart Joe), so when you start telling them you know this, prices start dropping. I negotiated a deal on the 40K MSRP loaner for $399 a month $0 due at sign with taxes in the payment this week. But I think December will bring even lower pricing, so I can wait - I am not in a rush
You can do better than that now…
All comes down to how motivated they are to sell it, and being at the right place at the right time.
$277 a month with $2k due translates into $333 (+$28 a month on every $1k in upfront). I wonder what trim that MSRP $44k sold for $35k has. Mine was barebones (convenience pack) $40k MSRP, selling at $36K, which shows dealer still have room to discount… I will come back to them in December, to see how eager they are to meet end of year performance goals lol
They only came off 10% on a loaner? That dealer has plenty of room if they so desire.
But this is an exciting science to get the deal out of the dealers showing that you know much more they think you do. Classical example of “uneducated customer is the best customer” rule.
I don’t play games, nor do I try to make the dealer think I know more than he thinks I do, or try to outsmart them. I give them an offer over email, they can see I know what I’m talking about at that point, we either engage from there or I move on to someone else. I don’t have time to play the back and forth game.
And how do you know your price makes sense?
Know the market. Research. Throw out a large net, and sometimes get lucky. Got a 48k 3 series for under 3/mo for 12k/yr. Got a 46k XT5 for under 3/mo for 12k/yr. Not everyone is walking into either dealer and getting those deals. You have to find the right car, and find the right dealership + have the right programs currently in play…not always easy.
and when you say 3/mo that’s with $Xk upfront?
zero out of pocket other than first payment and grab the keys.
I see, so what’s the rule of the discount on loaners - 16-20% and new cars - 10-15%?
11-12% on new is good. Anything beyond that is a bonus, as that eats all holdback. 15-20 is good on a loaner, again, anything beyond 20, you’re in the bonus round. Some will claim they got more…those are unicorns. Not saying you can’t get more, but it’s going to be finding the right mix of the car, the motivation of the dealer and being at the right place at the right time. You have to be willing to cast a far reaching net too.
and then rule of a good deal is 1% monthly on the post discount price? e.g. 48K MSRP example on a loaner -> 40K post discount (~17%) -> $400/month is considered a good deal?
The 1% rule is internet lore. Some cars will lease good at 1%. Some can come way under 1% and some will lease over 1% and still be “good.” It depends on the programs at each manufacturer. To just arbitrarily say 1% and you’re Golden is not a good strategy. You could be leaving $$$ on the table. Thus the reason to know your #s before waking into a dealership, and knowing the market as well as the current programs.
Most of the time, people refer to 1% of MSRP, but even then, nobody can come to a true consensus of what 1% is. There’s a thread here from a couple years ago that shows that many have different definitions of what 1% is.
Well, for X2 all i know is that there were deals for bare-bones loaners being $300-330 effective with tax, so what would an M Sport trim be ? $400? I am in the dark.