How can your mind be boggled when you don’t actually know how many people you’re talking about?
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Again, your claims have no factual basis. COVID-19 deaths are underreported across the board, not because I say, but because of the actual numbers coming out - including the initial numbers updated later by the Chinese government.
CDC Report that you won’t read because you don’t agree with it:
Also, if a person dies of respiratory failure after testing positive for COVID-19, it’s a COVID-19 death. It doesn’t matter if they have diabetes, COPD, asthma, heart conditions, etc. Do these patients with significant comorbidities have a higher chance of poor outcomes? Absolutely, but you cannot attribute the main cause of death as anything other than COVID-19 in these situations.
If a patient with a gunshot wound comes into my ER and dies, we’re not going to say the cause of death is because he had a quadruple bypass 5 years ago. The only reason you want the numbers to be less is because it supports your view that this pandemic isn’t as serious as you think.
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The asian countries have experience in SARS, they know how to control it better. Americans always make fun of them for wearing masks, you don’t remember that? Some\ have gotten beat up over wearing it too in Jan/Feb.
I don’t know enough about Belgium to comment on them, Italy’s and UK’s healthcare system are a joke, you are going to compare them to Sweden? If you have family there, visit them when this blows over.
NY and NJ did a horrible job, Newsome in CA had the balls to put in the shelter in place order. NY and NJ followed after because their governors were too scared to be the first. SD and some of the middle states never had the shelter in place order, you can see how well they are doing compare to the population. They kept everything open, guess what, business is still not as usual. https://www.keloland.com/news/capitol-news-bureau/latest-numbers-give-a-glimpse-at-how-much-covid-19-has-hurt-south-dakota-economy/
I do agree some of the rural places should have plans to start opening since they are relatively low risk.
You’re in California and as you’ve said, its never been bad at your hospital, but my next door neighbor is a nurse in NY Presbyterian hospital in the center of NYC. She’s been working 5 days a week for over a month now, and she has said things are not as bad as the media is making it out to be. The Mayor and Governor of NY have both been saying it the peak will be the end of this month, but she had already said 10 days ago, the numbers in NYP were down a lot, and dropping more each day.
So please go on an tell me your view of how bad things are, when you’re 3000 miles away from the front line and we’re in the middle of it. Gov. Cuomo cried about needing more ventilators and hospital beds. 3500 beds were provided within weeks which were mostly unused, and thank God he didn’t receive the 40-50,000 ventilators he said he needed, because he had 4,000 sitting in a warehouse in NJ that he was saving for the peak, and the additional vents he received mostly went unused, and were being redistributed to other hot areas as of last week.
Better safe than sorry?
But by any means, I want to go back to normal, who doesn’t.
And they treated people early with anti virals. Yes agree that they had better experience in handling but they did not fight about potential cures or intervened between doctor and patient. Again, my perspective from reading. And culture is different for sure. Seen the order in SK and Singapore firsthand. Glad we agree that low risk place should open up. 
You are not in the front of anything. I work half my shifts in the ER and half my shifts in a dedicated COVID-19 unit (because my hospital needed to float staff from other departments to take care or admitted covid patients). I come in contact with about a dozen covid positive patients in one shift. So, please, tell me how I’m not on the front lines.
Please tell my co-worker who had a nurse colleague from another Southern California hospital that passed away because she contracted COVID-19 while caring for patients.
PLEASE try to denigrate all of the healthcare providers that are outside of NY state - because according to you, we’re all safe in our states. You’ve shown your true colors now.
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Ok we can discuss this retort but hopefully someone that has seen both videos.
- Youtube and other social media deletinf that video was wrong and i view as censorship.
- Doctor blue scrubs here very accurately said that since they have only urgent care data of 6% and it cannot be extrapolated to general population since it is not random and highly captive population. However, the 2 doctors clearly pointed to random study done by Stanford in a county in CA, study done in MA, and also the antibody testinf done by NY as further support. Blue scrub doctor just skipped over those studies and I assume saying they are not scientific. Well if 3 other studies and what state of NY found point in the direction of the what 2 doctors stated, then I would believe various data sets in different part of the country versus this retort but that is just me.
- Hospitals clearly are not overwhelmed in most parts of the country based on furloughs i am reading about. Many elective or various surgeries are being pushed back and nobody knows what impact on those people will be. We did the lockdown to get over the peak. Well looks like we are over the peak and we handled it well.
- The 2 doctors did not say to go back like it was. They said to protect the high risk population but healthy people should not be kept in lockdown anymore. This blue scrub doctor made it seem the opposite.
- Covid seems to be highly contagious because I know 18 people that have had it. But of those 6 under 40 that had it had no symptoms at all and one had some cough and fatigues but back to work. The rest are above 55 and had symptoms range from 2 days to a week. 1 under 40 above 55 but heavy smoker had about a week of fever. 2 passed. Both above 65 and with underlying conditions. One of them was almost 80 and had 3 heart attacks and was in hospital since February. Its sad as they were fathers of two of my friends. So yes, blue scrub doctor is right, however he still did not support his point on the mortality rate data at all. In addition, the risk for under 55 seems to be very low. So again, like the 2 doctors said. High risk group be protected but healthy people should be allowed to go about their life.
Again, this is my opinion in seeing both videos and those 2 doctors spoke of various data and conversations they had with their ER friends. The retort had no data at all. And the 2 doctors made a clear case for domestic violence, molestations, and economic fallout.
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Oh look, more anecdotal evidence. You’re literally full of it. But I’m sure you’re busy on the front lines dealing with this terrible pandemic, so I’ll let you get right on that.
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I am not denigrating all healthcare workers outside of the NY Metro area, just disputing your assertions and if I came across as not caring about healthcare workers in others areas, I apologize and I do thank you for your services during this pandemic.
You have taken exception w/ me posting the videos of 2 Dr’s that are disputing the need for further lock-down of healthy people. I did not make these statements, only shared their interview for folks to consider if they agree that maybe healthy people should not be locked down anymore. If you don’t agree w/ Dr. Erickson and Dr. Massihi, then site their data / statistics that are wrong, along w/ your counter data.
I said we’re (meaning the NY Metro area) are on the front line, never said “I”. FYI, front line in a war is where the battle is the worst, and I don’t believe there are any US hotspots worse than NY Metro.
So explain how my neighbor nurse’s info from NYP, is any less anecdotal than yours?!? Do you not believe that my neighbor is a nurse and works at NY Presbyterian in the ER?
I’m gonna quote this over and over. Your apology is bullshit. You said what you said. There’s no taking it back.
You’ve made it crystal clear that only your area is considered the “front line”.
I’m 3000 miles away, so I can’t possibly know a thing or two about this outbreak.
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You took issue w/ these 2 Dr’s position, and some how have made this personal with me.
You are not addressing the points the Dr’s made, and want to make this about me. NY13 posted a good summary of the 2 videos 4 posts above, and his summary is valid, and i believe a lot of the points that Dr’s Erickson and Massihi gave in their interview.
If you don’t want to accept my apology for something said in msgs going back and forth, thats fine, but I am sincere in my apology and didn’t mean to slight anyone, particularly healthcare workers.
You are of one opinion, and I another, we can agree to disagree in the path forward. But our country might not come out of this depression if we go on another month or two w/ widespread lockdowns.
I don’t need evidence to refute an opinion piece. I don’t agree with their opinions. Their observations are based on their own personal experiences as urgent care doctors and testing they have done in their own clinics.
They are not specialists, nor are they responsible for public health (which is a relief).
I don’t think you actually understand how big of a world medicine is. Physicians are not created equal, especially when it comes to specialties.
Just as I wouldn’t trust a immunologist to treat a broken bone, I’m not trusting some emergency room doc over pandemic issues. And trust me, emergency medicine is MY department, so I have a ton of respect for our EM residents and attendings.
Sure, they can have an opinion, but to trust their word because they have an MD behind a name (actually a DO - but you wouldn’t know the difference would you?), it’s crazy.
There’s a reason YouTube took their video down, there’s a reason the medical community is up in arms about their video.
You can believe what you want, that’s your right. You can go inject bleach too or whatever. Just don’t come here and pretend it’s fact. It’s not.
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Didn’t they use their own patients as the sample population? I know Stanford’s test failed because it didn’t use random population, they were plugging upper middle class moms off Facebook.
I don’t think I did well in stats back in the days, I seem to recall random population is a must for these things🤯
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Yes, their data is completely unreliable because it has a glaring bias. They literally used their own symptomatic patients that walked into their 9 urgent cares as their population.
The debate ends right there. That’s why it’s an opinion piece. They have a right to their own opinions.
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I believe they used various data not just their emergency care data. NY was random of people in grocery stores and such from my understanding. MA study was random of people in the street I believe. And man maybe in that county in CA thats all there are just upper middle class moms? 
Again, the way these doctors are extrapolating is what NY is doing with their antibody testing. It was a long 12 minute video and I thought it was an interesting different view.
There’s also the usc study which claims a random sample of ~1000 representing la county
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I guess NY state and the other studies are having a glaring bias as well then. The doctors spoke of many data points and made a compelling argument of the other costs of shut down.