Tesla’s advantage will take time and money to whittle down.
A. range (they have more than anyone except Bolt as of now and easily more than any premium/lux models AFAIK)
B. Supercharging network
C. Don’t underestimate people’s ability to spend money without doing any research. EG It’s been ages and even now a lot of people think hybrid is synonymous with Prius. The same could hold true with EV and Tesla.
Seems like a Tesla hate thread. Musk may have his set of erratic behaviours and company could have handled various situations differently but the product speaks for itself. I lease i3s, have a 435i, and do own a Model 3. Love my 4 series but have found the model 3 to be even more of a blast to drive. Can accelerate quickly and 30-70mph is even quicker. Car updates roll out frequently and have never seen a car that can continuously add new features after purchase. The interior looked too minimalist to me when they announced the car but after sitting in it and using it a few months I absolutely love it, and operating it has been more intuitive then the idrive system. Interior definitely feels premium sitting in the car and passengers love the huge glass roof. What sets Tesla apart from the rest right now is their robust supercharger network which can take you all over the us and in California there are many of them. All electric 3 series and future cars won’t be able to compete unless they have 500 mile range or extensive charging infrastructure which will take some years. Autopilot also works better then the competition, I looked at the 530e, XC90 plug in and they had nothing as robust as Tesla’s system. Theyve started to ramp up production, selling large number and I believe Tesla is here to stay. Can’t wait for the competition to try to catch up and compete, the next 5 years will be interesting. Maybe we can leasehack an electric BMW M3 or Porsche Taycan in a few years…
FWIW, I’m not and haven’t hated on Tesla for anything unwarranted. Same for Musk. That said, to say the product speaks for itself, you’re right that it does and that’s been half the criticisms of this thread. The QA is absolutely piss poor and far and away the worst of any major manufacturer. I don’t care how long they’ve been in the manufacturing business because at the end of the day, we’re still talking $60k+ cars. The fit and finishes are a joke. Their CX is a joke. I won’t speak much to the interior because it’s mostly preference, but I will say that it’s been unanimous that it is cheap. The autopilot working better than the competition has already been dispelled in the articles claiming Tesla tested the worst when on autopilot. What they do have and are doing well is their network and pushing the competition to move faster than they would be if it hadn’t been for Tesla.
Do I want Tesla to succeed? Absolutely. Competition is good for everyone. Do I think they’re screwing customers over at the same time? A bit. Doing things like charging thousands of dollars for something not yet released, not yet dated for release, and not yet completed is a problem to me. Constantly missing goals on revenue, profit, and production while continuing to make BS claims to their investors and prospectives is crappy. I simply think it’s bad business, but again I’m also not the customer buying into that.
Not a hate thread, more of a ‘temper your expectations’ thread IMO. I’m in the camp that the product is okay at best but the technology is leagues ahead of the competition. I’m glad that you’re enjoying your Model 3, but everybody is going to walk away from the car (and most Teslas) with different subjective feelings. You may see the interior as ‘focused’ and ‘clean’ but I see it as ‘spartan’ and ‘boring’. You may prefer the touchscreen interface to handle everything, while I prefer physical buttons and stalks.
Rather than blind fanboyism (like DanCar) I think a lot of people have mixed feelings about Tesla, and that’s okay! The tech is amazing, and the cars that are put well together are great cars. The company itself is a basket case that’s not getting any help with Musk at the helm. You can’t ignore that QA issues plague the Model 3 cars being sold to customers, but the Model 3 has comfy seats and will 300 miles to a charge and out accelerate a BMW M3. I loved my stint with my Model S, but it ended up being a basket case of a vehicle that spent more time at Tesla than in my driveway.
Even with the Tesla advantage, it only make them a good short range/commute car. Overall, with the current infrastruture, they are still lousy road trip/long range cars.
the cost of charging a Tesla at super station is super cheap. But if most people use Tesla for commute, the cost of operation really shouldn’t matter. Most people spend $1500-$2000 or so a year on gasoline. Say Tesla will cost $500 for charging. That is $1500 saving in operation, but Model 3 is also $60K.
I am trying to wrap my head around the EV/Tesla usage model. I think Super charging station will need to have a lot more location to make Tesla as practical as a gasoline car. But I am too practical in this evaluation. Most Tesla buyers to date probably don’t do evaluation like I do.
Wouldn’t consider a Tesla just a commuter car. There are plenty of superchargers around and lots of hotels have Tesla destination chargers which are free. Right now if your in California and want to go to neighboring states it’s extremely easy to do and the car will route you to the nearest supercharger along your route if it needs a charge. The Model 3 LR can get over 300 miles per charge, and supercharging is getting quicker and quicker. Supercharges can get 200 miles of additional range in about 15 min and I have seen them charge at a rate of 450-490 miles per hour. Recently I went from Vegas from socal and didn’t have to stop 1 time. The hotel had a Tesla destination charger which was free and I left with a full charge back. Tesla is expensive though and financially isn’t the best value, but the product is capable.
Not on the east coast. Maybe out in California and some neighboring states.
The chicken/egg situation of the number of EVs vs the required infrastructure isn’t going away anytime soon. Near me a garage has a generic charger with a time limit of 4 hours. It’s used by 2.5 cars at present (a Tesla S, an i3 and a very occasional Volt) so these guys all just leave it charging overnight. This is going to become an issue with more EVs in the neighborhood.
They will not add more chargers anytime soon, due to the economics of installation costs and dedicating spots to EVs. Unfortunately due to the numbers of people with unresolved anger issues it is inevitable there will be some EV on EV road-rage/vandalism originating from people not respecting charging time limits.
I am in CA, in fact Bay Area. For normal daily use, I agree, I haven’t encounter any inconvenience. In fact, it is even more convenient because I don’t need gas station stop.
My recent trip from Mountain View to Lake Tahoe actually give me anxiety and inconvenience. Tesla, or maybe most EV recommend you to keep SOC at 50%. So day in an day out, my are at 60% charge. On the night before the road trip, I went to nearby super charger for a top off from about 45%, it took me 1 hour to get above 300 miles.
One the day, the trip planner said I should stop at Folsom for charge. I wonder why I can’t just make to Tahoe. Then I realized due to the uphill route, my range is 30% shorter, so Folsom stop made sense. I also have 8 month old, so we made quite a few unscheduled but short stop. None of these small stop has super charger. Keep in mind, when the baby started crying, you may not want to search for super charger for stop, you just stop on the next exist. When we got to folsom, I had 100 mile left. Charging back to full take 1 hour 15 min. By by that time, my 8 months old were sleeping. Given a choice, I would have keep driving until he woke up. And like this, other smaller inconveniences were throughout the trip.
Telsa fans will say I just haven’t get used to owning a EV, which is true. Can I make it work for road trip? YES. But to me, I’d like to have my trip where my car is the least of any concerns, this is speically true since I have a 8 month old. I don’t see Tesla is able to offer that. It may, but not just yet.
Even now, people get (rightfully) upset when an ICE takes a spot designated for EVs. At my school, there were only a couple EV spots, and they required special permits. Since they were closer to the entrances, sometimes regular vehicles would park there. One time, I saw some notes the EV drivers left for a guy who had illegally parked there (he got a ticket too lol):
I think the ticket is rightfully given.
I park in a public garage with eight plug in spots. I have seen someone park a Mirai there many times. I hope they get a ticket.
IDK why chargers are placed closer to entrances, it unnecessarily drives a wedge between EV and ICE driving people due to a perceived advantage being granted to one group over another.
Well, that didn’t take long…
I actually have a different outlook on the charging station situation (EVs in general, not just Tesla). Right now everyone is talking about “the infrastructure needs to get better!”. But the way I see it, as more EVs come out with bigger batteries and greater range (which seems to be the trend), we will actually need LESS EV charging stations since the cars will be able to travel further between charges. Of course having more charging stations is never a bad thing.
I think Tesla is getting an edge over other EV manufacturers right now with their supercharger network and is the most practical EV for long range travel right now.
If you are wondering what Elon thinks Model 3 track performance will be.
What’s he considering in the same class?
And what does “on the track” mean? A qtr mile or 50 laps of Spa?
Heres a BMW blogger’s article about that tweet in reference to the M3. Note, both were back in May…
And another comment from that tweet via Business Insider…
