It’s amazing how little regional pilots are paid considering the amount of training, skill, and expertise required to keep everybody safe. Flying smaller planes is harder too especially when you consider they’re flying in and out of shorter runways in tougher areas. Even commercial pilots don’t make what they used to. My friend flies for a large domestic airline and makes 85k but he’s relatively Jr
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So very inexcusable, BUT…?
It can’t “see” without the right sensors. No Teslas have LIDAR so even if the right sensors exist, they’re not deployed (none, anywhere).
We could argue all day I suspect about the value of training an AI on data that won’t help it make decisions (why Apple pulled all their engineers from self-driving and moved many back to Maps to get different scans and data sets). If you trained an AI with photos of box trucks it can’t render in 3D because the data lacks LIDAR (for instance), you’re corrupted it into thinking it can just pass thorough objects like that.
We’ll find out soon enough:
NHTSA is investigating all 127 claims of sudden acceleration that resulted in 52 injuries.
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True that there is no LIDAR on Tesla and Musk thinks that cameras are sufficient for self-driving but Model 3 does have a front radar sensor:
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Which is A thing, maybe not THE thing. Radar and LIDAR work differently and provide different data.
And see my earlier comment about multiple configs and generations of sensors, but possibly not the combination needed (or worse, Federally required). But heck Tesla could handle a recall at this point…
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I’m not saying Tesla has level five tech for highway driving now. I’m saying the tech will exist in 2030, likely involving using everything we have now, including LIDAR. Tesla’s failure to use LIDAR just shows we don’t really know where self driving tech is now.
Also, I continue to believe self driving tech will be safer than human drivers on highway by 2030 but not perfect. I view significantly safer than human drivers as good enough but I can see why opinions differ.
Tesla does, but go on.
That is a more realistic timeframe, and yes when a couple necessary components (including LIDAR) evolve, or something else can provide depth-of-field and surfaces that are camera-reflective, yes. At least that’s what everyone investing in this space and making progress claims.
Is based on the assertion of 1 God-King who claims it’s unnecessary. Period. Just like Kanban boards. And that all Model 3s will be fully assembled by robots (a fact which most production goals still espoused today are based).
Eventually I agree. People keep acting like that day is coming before the leftovers in my fridge spoil. It’s still out on the horizon, as illustrated by nearly four years of Musk promising an FSD LA to NY using the sensors and software they have today. It is as promising as it is not-ready for prime time.
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I love how many commenters here are now experts in computer vision and the complexities of neural networks. So if there is anyone left in this thread with a functioning neural network of their own please ask yourself who’s opinion holds more weight, a random out of their depth internet commenter or:
Anthony Levandowski backtracks on LIDAR. “Elon is Right”
Levandowski is one of the founding members of Waymo which is widely (and incorrectly imho) regarded as the current leader in the race to full autonomy.
Tesla is Going to Win Level 5 - George Hotz
Hotz is the founder of comma.ai an open source automated driving system and is also a known for being the first person to unlock an iPhone at the age of seventeen.
If that isn’t enough consider Tesla and SpaceX are consistently ranked as the top two most desirable companies to work for according to recent polls for engineering students in the top universities and therefore have their pick of the best young machine learning and computer vision talent in the country.
Lastly for anyone who actually knows what they are talking about, you already know that reliable perception/prediction is a much much harder problem to solve than path planning and current lidar implementations are basically ignoring the fundamental perception/prediction problem which will only lead to a local maximum.
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Regarding unintended acceleration: I find I have more issues with unintended braking than I do with the former. (AKA phantom braking)
Service centers are next to useless when addressing it with them and one has even said “Oh that’s normal, mine does it too”
Maybe it’s an attention getter. 
That’s not unintended braking. That’s Elon sending out a command to the cloud to remind everyone he’s in control. Lest you forget who the overlord is.
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New here but been browsing the site for a while now.
Just stumbled upon this thread and been reading the past 1 week of posts. I’m amazed by how this thread has been open for so long with nothing but arguments from both sides. I’m not against tesla being bankrupt nor for it. But hands down this is the most toxic thread (an argument above ended in one person saying go fuck yourself to the other???) on this otherwise helpful and great community.
@trusted_hackrs Can someone please tell me why this thread hasn’t been locked up till now? Maybe I’m missing something but is this helpful to the community in any way?
Tesla is a volatile company and invokes plenty of discussion. Better to keep this thread open than have a new one opened every time there’s a big event with their stock
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I agree Tesla is a volatile company and invokes lots of opinions from all folks. But
That’s my entire point though - This event is only going to invite further argument from both camps. Nothing productive, no real value to this community. Just a sounding board for people wanting to further solidify their position and their belief for/against the company. All this over something that no one knows the outcome for. Tesla might go bankrupt, might not go bankrupt. Only time can tell. Stock price, company valuation, company financials discussions would be better suited for a forum like Bogleheads.
I understand where you’re coming from but a thread that hasn’t had anything but arguments for months doesn’t help the community in my opinion 
Just my 2 cents.
Model X was never crash tested? I just stumbled upon this thread so apologies if you aren’t from the US
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Model x certainly has been crash tested, but it was not independently tested until after it had been on the market for several years.
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Car is vaporware, it will disappear all of a sudden one day
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Thanks for posting it here. The LIDAR part - super nice read from the expert.
I don’t believe L5 is anywhere in the cards for another 5 years at least. I would rather discourage people from betting on Tesla due to their autonomous driving tech. If they get very close - the goverment would step-in immidiately & decisevely due to a potential of wrecking the larger economy.
It can get even worse - there will be a patch work of (mis)regulations accross locales all over the country.
In this scenario, Tesla also will be forced not to sell this tech overseas.
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Which I presume describes you, as well.
Do you actually know anyone who works at SpaceX? I do (or did). I can’t comment on your polls, but an engineering company needs more than just engineers to make it successful…
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It also needs to keep its engineers and not burn them out.
You’ll notice the poll was among engineering students that hadn’t actually worked anywhere yet.
Now, the point was obviously that Tesla/space x have the pick of the litter of incoming students so they can choose the best of the best.
As someone working in an engineering company that attracts top tier talent, I will say that fresh out of college students generally need to develop quite a bit of on the job experience to be significant contributors to a product, unless we are talking fresh out of a PhD program.
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Since it is clear you suffer from some cognitive impairment and missed the entire point of my previous post let me spell it out for you. Whether I am senior CV engineer in FAANG or bagging groceries at the local market holds no relevance to the links I provided where objective experts in the machine learning / Computer Vision space share their highly educated views on Tesla’s current approach to full autonomy.
Now I won’t presume to have your incredible credentials of knowing someone who worked at SpaceX. But I will put forth that the only metric that matters is results and any objective, rational, and informed individual knows that SpaceX stands alone in that regard.
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Not necessary. Keep it civil. No need for snarky digs like this.
That goes for all, not just you.
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