Honda and GM are utilizing the Ultium platform, supplied by LG Chem last I heard.
Toyota is cozying up with BYD.
CATL was favored but their some geopolitics that ruled them out. Ford however uses CATL for the lightening I believe?
Completely agree here. Toyota fanboys were paying way over MSRP for the RAV4 Prime while the RAV4 in general was pretty crappy. The Bolt EUV is a better vehicle in every way, it just has the stigma of being a “Chevy”. As others mentioned, Honda already bought in on Ultium, at least they had the common sense to partner and use GM/LGs tech. Toyota is too proud and will likely miss the EV boat.
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IIRC Toyota was an early investor in Tesla. The RAV4 EV used a Tesla power train. The fact that Toyota is so late is incredibly lame given the history with Tesla and the fact they have been making hybrids for 20+ years and plugins for 10.
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To be fair… Nissan has had the Leaf EV out for quite a while (although maybe not “desireable”). And the Mitsu PHEV has been out for a long time (and supposedly the best selling PHEV in the world?). And there was the Clarity EV from Honda.
But I do wonder why most of the Japanese automakers have eschewed EVs. Maybe complacency as their sales volume has been pretty high.
I recall an announcement that Toyota was going to focus on lower range lower cost EVs which I think is smart to capture local commuters and places where charging infrastructure is good.
They should focus on Lightning/EQB style EVs where they just replace the ICE components so they don’t have to retool assembly lines all that much until they can build it dedicated platforms.
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I actually think they were planning to wait until solid state batteries were mainstream. Toyota are leaders in solid state batter tech, with their joint venture with Panasonic(they hold the most patents by a mile). They should be the first to release a vehicle with a solid state pack, most likely next gen Prius hybrid.
Q3 numbers just released, EV’s still at single digit market share(6%). This shift to EV’s is not going to happen overnight. The 50% market share by 2030 goal is very optimistic, without a major breakthrough in battery tech. Solid state batteries, which will be the real driver to mass adoption is 10+ years away.
All these brands that have dedicated to full transitions to EV’s, will all be fighting for a very small market share for years. Tesla still owns the space with a 65% market share of EV sales.
Ford is switching to LFP batteries from CATL starting 2024 for both Mach E and Lightning.
SK Innovation currently provides batteries for Lightning.
B/c they were pursuing hydrogen?
Was it that they were going to focus on lower-cost EVs (which is not an announcement I recall reading about) or that they wanted to produce a more full range of battery-assisted cars (hybrids + EVs) specifically b/c they sell cars in many places where the charging infrastructure is NOT good.
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Did SK and LG chem resolve that lawsuit of theirs?
Lower costs EVs are only achievable with reduced battery costs (majority of vehicle cost) which currently a problem every single mfg has, and is working on (including tesla) AND mfging costs which right now looks only achievable with dedicated platforms (which knowing Toyota they can reduce quite rapidly but they insist on that one modular platform strategy that everyone before them has tried and failed at).
One platform for EVs and ICE? Or one platform for EVs and one platform for ICE? B/c isn’t the partnership w/ Subaru to con’t to develop a separate platform for EVs?
Bingo. Toyota in particular bet big on Hydrogen and lost. Another trend I noticed over the years with Japanese automakers has been viewing EVs and other alternative fuel cars as just a weird California compliance car experiment that kept their fleet MPG up.
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To clarify, the E-TNGA platform was designed to be an EV only platform. However the design principles allowed the E-TNGA platform to be assembled on the same production line, as a ICE/HEV/PHEV.
This usually just means, take an existing platform ICE/HEV/PHEV, and adapt it.
Some reports state their current BZ4x production targets that were used to design E-TNGA underestimated market demand of EVs, but I dont understand how that’s the fault of the architecture?
That hydro bid isnt that bad. The number of battery patents and experience they hold is impressive. The issue thats hitting them hard is battery supply. Their public facing press release, like everyone else is “WE HAVE TONS OF CAPACITY COMING ONLINE” yet the math on the amount of supply is quite the opposite. I assume silent deadline changes are going to be the norm.
Is it battery supply or the lack of hydrogen fueling stations? I would assume it’s very much the latter.
I think the fuel tanks also take up a significant amount of room. Reviews of the current gen Mirai say its an overall lovely car but that the space utilization is surprisingly poor (given its exterior dimensions).
BMW and Toyota recently announced a joint venture to produce hydrogen fuel cell vehicles and be selling them by 2025.