The Captive Matrix

Wiki
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Updated:

  • A number of changes between V1 and V8 (last night) to cleanup a few things, most importantly adding a link to SUPPORT LH YOU RATS (nobody has clicked on that link in over 300 views)
  • Formatting Changes including additional footnotes about Captive and their DBA. Appreciate all the feedback here (will try to address below)
  • Links to all the FS homepages that I can find or deserve it under the Captive Column. Under the Captive’s DBA column I’ve tried to link to the NMLS entity that is the actual bank these call centers move payments through
  • Added some additional explainer text at the bottom. TL;DR there is a complex web of ownership among the OEMs and their brands, which is not always reflected in the ownership/relationship of the Captive lender, but every OEM has a captive.

Still To-Do (anyone with edit access is welcome to jump in here):

  • SETF and Tesla
  • CCAP vs Santander
  • Third Parties and CULA
  • Double-check who allows/forbids transfers (I updated based on the linked article but it doesn’t cover all brands)

Comments on your comments - please keep the relevant ones coming:

Can we try not to litter the wiki articles with extraneous discussion, please? We have plenty of other plates to do that.

Updated: VW FS and Audi FS are VW Credit (NLMS linked), PFS is its own along with Bugatti etc. Someone else can add extra entries for the exotics if there is enough demand, my goal here was to make this useful for 98% of questions we get regularly.

Updated. Hoping @mllcb42 will get in here soon because what I know about CCAP and Stellantis Financial fits comfortably on a stamp.

I didn’t spend much time here on V1 b/c everything I know is still subject to NDA, and I know most of it was in the public domain but I hadn’t looked at those sources yet. I spent a little more time today: Hyundai/Kia is one of those with a weird ownership structure, Hyundai is an investor in Kia but doesn’t own them. That aside, Hyundai and Kia and Genesis FS are all DBA’s for Hyundai Motor Finance (the bank with its own NMLS ID) so all three of those are updated. In the explainer text where I mention “ignore those relationships”, this is one where the OEM org chart doesn’t match the financial’s org chart. But the wiki should be accurate now.

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Volvo is $450 for the dispo fee

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Yes it is, updated. I pulled that from the Rate Finder, I should have looked at the lease agreement sitting on my desk.

@littleviolette are the disposition fees in the LH Calculator/Rate Finder hard-coded, or do you get those through the rate data API?

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Disposition fee is manually updated on the Calculator. We usually update it when the community notifies us that there is a change.

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We have a few data points including my own experience of CULA 3rd party buyouts, are there situations where the underlying CU won’t allow it?

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The only datapoint I can think of and is probably not needed but pre 2020 Mazda leases were Chase?

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SFS does have a restriction on 1P buyouts of EV and PHEVs, as of June 7th (contracts dated before that may have the restriction, but are not required to)

It’s worth adding that CCAP acquisition fees can vary wildly by trim and lease term. $595 is “standard”, but there are times where due to lease terms, region, trim, etc the acquisition fee is higher. This is independent of any potential dealer markup.

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And before that they were Ford. Tried to address in the explainer text: this is intended as a resource for people looking at leasing in the present moment, it’s not intended to be historically complete.

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Not sure if it’s worth adding as a footnote or disclaimer, but I’ve never seen a MBFS lease without the acq marked up to $1095

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Maserati is Maserati Capital (Chase)

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VW lease transfers

Table above doesn’t indicate * on lease transfer meaning liability won’t stay w original leassor

But swapwase has different info (unless I read above table wrong)

Can’t find this info on VW Finance site yet.

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Do they clarify anywhere what the asterisk ties to?

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Nope :expressionless:
So that isn’t really helpful but I could not easily locate VW info on their own site with a search. Have to dig

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I’d suggest calling, this sort of info feels to me like it’s internal policy on memos and sticky notes.

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Matrix indicates KIA allows MSDs… is this verified? (I don’t see this in calculator, and Hyundai is listed as No as well (so I assume they are consistent)

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Kia doesn’t do MSDs. It looks like the entries for Kia got shifted one to the left somewhere. Notice there’s no answer to the final box

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ahh good catch, that must be it!

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Is there any interest amongst the community in adding a column to note whether manufacturers apply incentives based on registered zip or dealer zip? (Of course, we would have to crowd-source this information, not sure if this exists elsewhere)

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Unless I am looking at the this wrong on my phone, I believe the entry for MB Finance needs to be updated as they don’t allow lease transfers as far as I know, otherwise we would see bunch EQ cars posted for transfer on the forum…

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