I'm Interested in Hyundai Kona EV Limited/Ultimate. Not having luck with dealers providing prices via phone or email

Speaking of markup…

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This does beg the question: Genesis/Palisade/Telluride aside, maaaaaybe Stinger… are people in that income bracket really reaching out for Hyundai/KMF products at the moment? I’m honestly curious about that, I get the whole “stealth wealth” thing but that’s usually with people who pay cash for used and/or drive a new paid for car till the wheels fall off. And it’s not to knock Hyundai, I’m all for the “car for every purse” type of thinking.

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Not on Leasehackr…

No one is here looking to pay at/over market, only under. You seem passionate about this, yet you fail to grasp this simple concept. Perhaps look into working with a dealer directly as a salesperson or try another brand.

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Please read my message again. I didn’t spend more than 3 or 4 hours negotiating each deal. I was able to get TWO deals over the course of THREE weeks. And they were from two separate dealers.

My point is I think anyone who pays you is wasting money, you shouldn’t be charging for the deals you are offering because someone could walk into a dealership and get the same deal.

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You’re absolutely entitled to this opinion and you’re not alone. I’m not discouraging people taking advantage of my free content (combined with any other data points they find online) to lease a car, without ever paying me. The vast majority of people do print out my Leasehackr thread, and then march straight into dealerships, without paying me a dime. The only people that pay my $249 service fee are people that want to work with me directly. The paying customers are a small minority of the people that find my post useful, and I’m okay with that!

Next question:

Here’s my opinionated take:

With most cars being more expensive/worse programs due to chip shortage Summer 2021, people that have leases ending from 2018-era should probably buy their leases out. For people that can’t/didnt/won’t buy-out that are shopping, getting the “same thing” is, on average, more expensive than it was 3 years ago.

So, yeah, Hyundais have gone up, but they’re still cheaper than “nicer” cars with similar equipment/features, especially because those nicer cars may have also gotten disproportionately more expensive.

I kinda see 4 (soon 5) different mini demand curves in the Hyundai-verse.

  • Cheap/Small Gas Cars: Elantra, Sonata, Kona, Venue, Ioniq Hybrid Gas. The supply is relatively healthy on these, and so is demand. This is what will get cheaper first. I’m already seeing them start to come down, walls cracking. There’s always a market for wealthy people that want an inexpensive lease: child’s first car, parent’s last car, adding a commuter to a 1-car family, etc. There’s also always a market for not-so-wealthy people just looking for a fair value.

  • The EVS. This is a whole new world for the dealers, and where I stand to make the biggest impact by encouraging them to increase their supply, and risk-tolerance in ordering truckloads of these cars, and building out enough chargers to charge the inventory. My goal is to get these to the same competitive landscape as the cheap/small gas cars for Hyundai dealers.

  • Tucson & Santa Fe. Cannot keep these in stock, demand is far outpacing supply. midsize SUV segment is too popular and busting at the seams. Prices are crazy

  • Palisade. Huge potential for good lease deals on these once supply catches up. Right now, too supply-constrained.

  • [Coming Soon] Santa Cruz. Small pickup truck from Hyundai is also gonna be a new market, so we’ll figure that out when they start rolling in.

Literally anyone can pick up the phone right now and call any dealer that has one of these in stock and say “hey can i get one for MSRP?” and they’ll say yes. not one will say “ohh no sorry we’re holding out for $3k over…”

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I’m sorry, but any dealer engaging in that kind of practice needs to be reported to the NJ BPU and have their ability to participate in the program revoked. This is intended to be a consumer incentive to increase EV adoption, not be a welfare program for dealers looking to take advantage of people too stupid or too desperate to know any better. I can’t imagine that the program administrators would be particularly happy about that kind of thing if they received enough complaints.

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I agree with you. Here are some of the tricks dealers are using to increase the selling price or “sell you a car at msrp” while actually jacking things up:

  • Mandatory VIN etching, paint protection, KARR alarm, etc
  • Mandatory back-end-products (service contract, tire and wheel, etc)
  • Unusually high doc fees, dealer prep fees, etc

Unfortunately, the way the CHARGE UP NJ, program is designed, the dealers can more or less do all of the above, even if the BPU is a stickler for the “sell price” of the cars.

Additionally, some dealers simply refuse to participate in CHARGE UP NJ, despite meeting eligibility requirements. I met with one dealer that wants $2500 over sticker per Kona, and they also refuse to participate in CHARGE UP. This is making their deals as much as $7500+ more expensive than some of the deals posted on this site. My jaw hit the floor when they told me they had no intention in ever signing up for CHARGE UP NJ, and that they don’t believe in the program. They feel confident they can deplete their inventory, at these bonkers prices, and would rather not be bound by the program conditions.

I can absolutely see short-sighted dealers saying “we’d rather retain our right to mark up cars than be able to participate in the NJ BPU’s program; EV’s are such a small percentage of our sales anyway”. I actually wouldn’t have believed this line if I didn’t hear it straight from the horse’s mouth; but this is the landscape for these cars/dealers right now.

Regulating the prices that dealers sell cars for is actually really hard for the state to do. I think I speak for everyone here when I say that I wish there was more the state could do.

How about the tricks when a broker posts a snap of a monthly and random due at signing amount without disclosing the actual specifics of what went into the deal? How come established brokers have to disclose what they’re selling a car for and all of the rebate/incentive money that goes into a deal, while someone looking to capitalize on price gouging (while also gouging himself) doesn’t have to?

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This isn’t a rule that we’re held to. You don’t have to; you choose to. If there was a rule to write the ad in a specific way, I would follow it to maximize consistency with everyone else! And, I have not changed how I list prices since the shortage began. I’ve tried to keep a consistent format across market conditions. Is there always room for improvement in my ads? Yes. Are they intentionally deceptive? Absolutely not.

I negotiate with my dealer partners using DAS and monthly figures, so these are the figures I publish. I make no effort to hide or cover up when cars are over sticker. And honestly, if this is such a contention point, I can start flagging which deals are over sticker and which are under. There’s really no attempt at deception here. If you text me “is this car over sticker price?”, I can crunch the numbers, and tell you “yes” or “no” for each relevant model/trim. I can look into a flag, icon, or marker that highlights this for the “I won’t ever pay more than sticker” crowd, so they know to skip over me!

I don’t capitalize on price gouging because I am always flat-rate. I absolutely do not care what the profit margin is on the cars, or if the dealers are losing money due to dealer discounts. I insist on charging the exact same flat-rate broker fee regardless of the dealer’s margin, positive or negative, sales volume, or market conditions.

Give this a few months, and, hopefully, all of the cars will be below-MSRP again. It would be extremely short-sighted of me to design my pay plan around gross profit, when, for most of recent history, there hasn’t been much gross profit in these cars.

Hyundais going over MSRP is a hot-button discussion in a lot of places right now (see https://www.reddit.com/r/askcarsales/comments/otdkda/15k_over_stickermsrp_fora_pallisade/). Nobody wants it to be this way, but, really, I’m just the messenger. I don’t mind people ripping into me, as the messenger, but I can’t magically solve the problem by myself.

How many people would say yes if they knew they were paying $2k over sticker

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I regret that I have but one like to give…

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Ended up getting Kona Ultimate.

36/12k. $2k down+first month $268. Checked with many dealers and most quoted $340+ for 10k with zero down. I needed 12K. I guess limited would’ve been a better deal but I needed smart cruise which unfortunately is only offered on Ultimate Trim.

Dealer has 5 ultimate on lot so I guess if anyone is interested, DM me and I can send dealer info.

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Do you have the contract sheet?
I am interested in your deal and wanna get it. but 36/10k in my case.
Just sent you DM please check it out.
Thanks

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