I have been able to match my deal to the last dollar by playing around with the calculator, however I am curious why in this deal:
a. Cap Cost Reduction goes into the down payment and not as a taxed incentive despite being taxed.
b. “Rebates and Noncash Credits” are considered “Post-Sales Incentives”
Calculator: Leasehackr Calculator - Hack your next lease | Leasehackr
the calc always has a bit of a problem display Due at Signing vs Down.
It’s been a known bug
Yes the Down is negative. Look at the Due on the right. , though I’m still off a $1.50 or so
2000 is due at signing, not 5000. The 5000 includes the 3000 rebate. I don’t use online calculators as they can provide misleading information. Instead, I use my own developed formulas.
According to the agreement, you owe 2000 at signing. This is way too much IMO. A car is a depreciating asset and, as such, it is an expense not an investment. Also, if the car is stolen or totaled, you risk losing all or some portion of the 2000. I prefer to structure my own leases otherwise; you’re allowing the dealer to control the deal. Bad idea. So, I have structured the lease so that your risk in minimal…
Sell Price… 65635.00
Capitalized Amounts… 122.00***
Gross Cap… 65757.00
CCR… 19.39
Adj. Cap… 65737.61
RV… 44951.20
MF… 0.00226
Term… 36
Rebate… 3000.00
Base Payment… 827.56
Monthly Payment… 912.38
Lease Inception Fees
1st payment… 912.38
Acq Fee… 1095.00
Acq Fee Tax… 112.24
CCR… 19.39
CCR Tax… 1.99
TLR + CA Tire Fee… 959.00
TOTAL FEES… 3100.00
Rebate Credit… 3000.00
DAS… 100.00
Bottom line: DAS = 100 followed by 35 monthly payments of 912.38 each.
Yes, your payment is more by 58.84. However, you’re saving nearly 2000 upfront which would be at risk. Your choice… there are no right or wrong decisions in this case. However, every decision has a consequence.
***The 122 should include 85 doc fee. I can’t account for the 37 balance as you did not post the itemization of the gross cap (second page).
??? Let me know.
Your assumptions behind these questions are incorrect.
The rebates/incentives don’t go in the post-sale rebate section and “Cap Cost Reduction” doesn’t go into the down payment vs taxed incentive area.
The applied incentives go into either the “taxed incentives” or the “untaxed incentives” section of the calculator, depending on how they’re applied.
Your calculator doesn’t match the deal at all. Your due at signing amount is off by thousands of dollars, the fees aren’t broken up properly with some missing, your selling price doesn’t match the contract, etc.
This more accurately matches the actual deal. A negative down payment amount is entered for the delta between the taxed incentives and what is applied as a cap cost reduction to cover the additional items elected to be capitalized but not covered by the due at signing amount.
Thank you! The balance $37 is Electronic Filing Fee.
I don’t understand the negative downpayment. What does it even mean?
Thanks! What does a negative down payment mean though?
Reg. my calculator, I did happen to add the dealer fees (doc and electronic filing) into the cost, but the tax worked out to the same amount both for the monthly and DAS. Again, I don’t understand how the thing works - the $5k DAS in my calculator reflects what’s on the contract, but not the $2k I actually paid.
In this calc it helps to manipulate the DAS amount.
It’s what math (stats) people would describe as a dummy variable. Look at @mllcb42 LH calc where the taxed incentive (cap reduction) is 3000 and the down payment (same as taxed cap reduction is -1204). This means that the total cap reduction is 3000 + -1204 = 1796 per the contract. This is just an intermediate calc to get you to the 1796 cap reduction and, as @gohawks23 stated, is used to get DAS = 2000. This is why I never use online calculators as they can require meaningless inputs to produce meaningful outputs. YIKES! To make up for the calculator’s short comings, sometimes you need to get creative. In this case, the LH calc gives a meaningful bottom-line result…
DAS = 2000 followed by 35 monthly payments of 854 each.
It’s important to note that the tax incentive field is populated with amounts like rebates (money coming from the manufacturer, not you) and the down payment field populated with money coming from you.
BTW, despite its short comings, the LH Calc is the best I’ve seen by far.
Your calculator output of DAS = 5000 is wrong. If you look at Section 5(b) in your contract, your DAS = 2000. The 2000 is the amount paid by you in cash. The 3000 is the rebate which you don’t pay. This is why @mllcb42 needed to get creative ( -1204 downpayment) so that the LH calc did not produce a misleading output of 5000.
Of course it would. The capped 122 gets taxed as it is part of the monthly payment. In fact, for those states that tax the monthly payments as they are received, tax will be levied on the amounts capitalized whether they’re taxable or not (e.g., non-taxable gov fees). If you pay non-taxables upfront, they don’t get taxed.
The 296.34 tax is calculated as follows…
10.25% x (1796.12 + 1095) = 296.34 per the contract.
It’s basically a way to account for how much of the incentive is not being applied as a cap cost reduction.
When you plug an incentive into the calculator, it is applied as a cap cost reduction. Since your deal has more in upfront fees/taxes than your $2000 due at signing would cover, some of that $3000 incentive has to be used to cover the upfront instead of as a cap cost reduction.
A negative down payment amount is a cap cost addition. So you are adding back in how much is applied to the upfront instead of as a cap cost reduction.
The 1796.12 cap reduction is a calculated number. No need to be concerned with a negative down payment used to back into the 1796.12 unless you’re using the LH calculator….
3000 + (-1203.88) = 1796.12
To use the LH calculator, you must treat 1796.12 as a given, which is not good as it is a calculated number. So, when populating the LH Calc downpayment field, you need to ask yourself what number added to 3000.00 will give me 1796.12? And, of course, it’s (-1203.88). The LH calculator is unable to calculate the 1796.12 cap reduction because the rebate is used to pay the 1796.12 and the balance of the upfront fees. Per the contract, it is computed using the following formula…
Substituting the assigned values in the equation above yields CCR = 1796.12. Because the 3000 rebate is insufficient to cover all upfront fees, you’ll need to pay the upfront balance which is 2000 per the contract. Note that the dealer selected 5000 realizing that the rebate is insufficient. As I mentioned in an earlier post, the dealer could have selected 3100 so that your upfront balance due is only 100 instead of 2000.
No negative numbers here!
Wow, what a discussion! I am amazed and (hopefully) enlightened at the same time 
Thank you so much @delta737h and @mllcb42 for patiently addressing my curiosity and educating me and others often confused with the relationship between that lease worksheet and the LH calculator!
You’re very welcome. Glad we were able to help.
