2021 Toyota Mirai for $17,995 with $15000 fuel card [ 0% financing purchase & no lease )

Not doubting you but are you sure it’s for the new design 2021?

It is. https://www.autoblog.com/2021/03/10/2021-toyota-mirai-incentives/

It also comes with extended maintenance (for a total 3 years) and 21 rental days for longer trips.

If any exiting Mirai owners are reading this, they have a referral program which is unclear but seems to offer ~$400 of incentives.

I don’t see the Mirai in the list of Vehicles for the $5k CVAP …

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You are right… I don’t think Fuel Cell counts for CVAP.

Additionally, be aware that gas-delivered hydrogen stations have had 2 shortages in the last 12 months. I believe the liquid-to-gas conversion ones are OK. But 80% at the moment are gas-delivered stations.

Also, the Mirai despite being a gorgeous RWD car, takes almost 10 seconds to get from 0-60.

Lastly, I can’t find anyone who will buy a used Mirai. No one (dealers/Vroom/Carvana/Shift) is even accepting them as trade-ins.

Toyota dealers are selling used 2017 Mirais for as low as $10,500, with a $15,000 fuel card included. Honda is not even trying to sell its used fuel cell vehicles. It is destroying them. I do not think there will be much, if any, demand for a used 2021 Mirai in the future.

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Fuel cells qualify for CVAP.

Hopefully someone out there is working on an aftermarket conversion to convert hydrogen cars to EV.

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Yes I’ve one. If you’re buying one, I’ll share his contact

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I’ve heard you can export them to europe for decent money

True but at this price why would you even care frankly. You’re getting a car for almost free with the fuel card

No it does. CVAP letter does states Hydrogen Cell vehicles

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Is a 18k boat anchor, albeit one with 4 wheels and occasional fuel supply, a good deal?

$18K is not but $10.5K is.

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Re CVAP, only three dealers that sell Mirais are on the approved CVAP dealers list: San Francisco Toyota, Toyota Sunnyvale and Toyota of Orange.

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Note that while it’s $15k of hydrogen fuel, that doesn’t mean it’s the equivalent of $15k worth of gasoline. Not sure what the ratio is, it really depends on the $/mile for a hydrogen with the Mirai and which vehicle it’s the equivalent of (Prius, Camry Hybrid, 530e without the battery charged, etc).

I read one review of the prior model Mirai that stated that the cost per mile was about 4 times as expensive as a regular Prius. Assuming the Prius gets 50 mpg, the Mirai equivalent would be 12.5 mpg.

Yeah I definitely wouldn’t want to be one of the early adopters for the Mirai. Tons of headache trying to manage the fill-ups and Hydrogen is extremely expensive+sparse. There’s no guarantee that these will ever have any re-sell value, so once that cash card runs out, you might be stuck with an expensive driveway ornament.

We have 2 clarity fuel cell (one approaching lease return, another one has 2 more years left), I am just sharing our humble opinion on H2 vehicles.

If I can conclude our H2 experience for the last 3 years in one simple term, it would definitely be “not yet”

We are about 5 miles away from Diamond Bar station, supposedly we should be consider the ideal H2 users , but in reality, it’s much more complicated.

Pros:

  1. You really get free gas , with some inconvenience (or unbearable for some, I will explain later)
  2. All Nexo, Clarity FCV, new or old gen Mirai are pretty much fully loaded top Trims from the corresponding brand., features like HUD , Leather Seat, Vent Seat(optional on some brand), 360 camera (nexo and Mirai top Trim), ACC , Premium Audio (Krell for Nexo, JBL for Mirai, Honda’s premium audio for Clarity)
  3. Very good dollar per mile ratio , especially for low incomers, you can get this FCV pretty much for free (CVAP + CVRP+ Heavy subsidized manufacture rebates)
  4. Really quiet and comfortable ride
  5. Zero emission on the road (however most of the H2 still produces based on natural gas)
  6. Clarity gives 20k miles per year , if you drives a lot (and don’t mind the waiting, anxiety and frustrations on H2 stations, it’s absolutely a deal breaker for some)
  7. HOV sticker and other EV related benefits
  8. 21 days free car rental (not your budget cars, but full size SUV like Ford Explorers)

Now lets get to the ugly parts of relying on H2 to be your primary transportation

  1. Station , station , station , station – if someone like me (5 miles away from the H2 station) is having this issue, please be extra cautious on this.
    a. stations will be down frequently (only question is for how long, DB station was down for almost 2 weeks due to power issues)
    b. Due to the high demand of H2 , you will NEVER fill your tank 100% (80 to 90 percent is the most common you will get)
    c. the wait time can be 40 mins to 1 hour long depends on the situation
    d. If you have range anxiety on EVs, try H2 …
    e. the H2 price keeps going up (not a big deal of a leased car, but for someone that’s going to own the car, it’s roughly 5x more the price than a Hybrid car)

  2. Fuel efficiency
    My Clarity is listed at 360 miles , but the absolutely maximum I’ve ever achieved was roughly around 260 miles , any elevation of climate change would simply kill the efficiency radically. If you are in colder area with lots of elevation , please think again (elevation + climate + tank will never be full) , you are look at minimum of 30% reeducation from your EPA estimates.

  3. Hidden cost

a. The maintenance is around $250 every 10k mile (Toyota and Hyundai gives first 3 years or 36000 maintenance for free) if you are buying them expect paying $250+ for future maintenance
b. Registration is around $1000 per year (not a joke, CA uses MSRP value to calculate your vehicle’s registration fees), most of the FCV are in the 50s or 60s range , you are going to pay for that amount.
c. Insurance premium is roughly 30 more than a similar equipped hybrid car (Clarity fuel cell costs more than my BMW M2 as a reference)

  1. Others
    Ultra slow performance (usually in the 8s to 9s in term of 0 - 60MPH), high probability of weeks (sometimes month long) repairs (our first FCV was sitting in shop for 2 months (waiting for parts to be shipped)

Consider Honda going to crush all the lease return FCVs (no plan for another fuel cell vehicles anytime soon) , I would say it’s a failed experiments for them as of today (Toyota is still in the game) .

We got our first FCV 3 years ago, for the first 12 month , it was actually a pretty good experience (that’s why we got the 2nd FCV 1 year later), things are going down hills from there (consistent station downs, ultra long wait time , range anxiety due to the unpredictability of H2 station…) we are regret to say getting 2nd H2 vehicle was a mistake for us so far :frowning:

in conclusion, if you don’t mind to have consistent wait or station downs (weeks in some occasions) and having all the time and patience in the world for you next re-fuels. FCV cars are probably the best you can get in term of Per mile costs. However, if you are somebody like myself who needs a reliable transportation for work (I’m an IT consultant, who travels all over the places) , simply get a EV or Hybrid . Lack of H2 will make your life miserable frequently (no jokes).

My 2 cents.

Jason

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Appreciate the write up - I’ve always been curious about FCV since I live down the street from a H2 station but I think I’ll stick with my current split of Tesla sedan and gas SUV!

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Basically describes my situation too. Except LEAF, Tiguan (also RSX Type S).