Is it normal to get REALLY bad first offers? Nissan Maxima and Ford Fusion (Atlanta, GA)

Ask the Hackrs
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Hackers,
This will be my first lease and I am being as clear as possible with the sales guys I meet at the dealership, which I believe might be the reason why they are giving me such bad deals. Or maybe they are good deals and I am just not seeing it.

Here they are:
Nissan Maxima S 2018, Pretty new (14 miles).
Initial Offer was:
**MSRP: $35265
**Selling Price: $25370 (After $9895 “discount”)
**DAS: $6000 Down, nothing included, not even first month payment (!!!)
**Monthly payment: $298 Tax included
**Term: 36 months lease,
**12K Miles per year.

Then they did the Sales Manager and Finance Manager “dance” trying to get me to close the deal right there and offered me:
DAS: $3700 with $318 tax included.

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Does the above “Fees” sound BS to you too? “Lifetime Nitrogen?” Really?

Second “deal”:
I’ve decided to go American then… Eagle has landed! I will get a great deal on a Fusion right? Well…
2019 Ford Fusion SE
**MSRP: $24997
**Selling Price: $23247 (After $1750 discount)
**DAS: $3000 Down, nothing included
**Monthly payment: $333 Tax included
**Term: 36 months lease
**10.5K Miles per year

Sorry I don’t have a picture of the sheet as they did not allow me to take one (!!), but I wrote down the breakdown of the deal:
**Dealer Doc Fee: $799
**Non-Tax Fees: $95 (What exactly this will be covering?)
** GATAVT Tax Fee: $1063.48

I was never informed about Money Factor or Residuals on any of the vehicles above.

What am I doing wrong? Is my approach being clear that I know nothing (Jon Snow) about leases making them offer me these kind of deals?
Is it fine to ask about the actual Money Factor and Residuals before they run my credit?
I have a pretty decent Credit Score (near 750) which I’ve mentioned to them, but they are really trying hard to get my social to “run the exact numbers”.

Thanks for any advice to a newbie here, guys. I’ve been reading the forum for sometime trying to learn as much as I can and when I come across posts like this: $129/mo + tax $860 DAS 2018 BMW X1 xDrive28i Loaner
I figure I might have been doing something wrong… Should I go Mercedes or BMW to have a better lease?

Anyway, thanks again!
Thiago P.

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Rule number 1, don’t go to dealer for numbers, online/phone.

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@joeblogs, lesson learned. Lost half of my Saturday (with a baby in the car) doing that. :-/

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Yes they all start with crappy offers first. So what. Don’t focus on that. Do your research and counter back with an offer you want. During a leisurely afternoon you can email a hand full of dealers around you. It is easier to lease cars that are popular here because most of the legwork has been done. If you want a very aggressive deal it will take time but if you want a good deal you can accomplish that very quickly with the info her.

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Yep, they always start with trash numbers unless you’re really specific about what you’re looking for and all those ADM on first offer tells me “don’t walk, RUN”

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Got it. Thanks.

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I will change my approach and start being very specific. Also, will send out emails before driving there. Thanks.

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By specific, source the buy rate (MF), residuals, and rebates for the vehicles you’re looking at and plug that in to LH Calc along with the numbers you’ve otherwise been offered (don’t forget to throw the ADM’s out the window)

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There’s no need for them to have you SSN to give you exact number. Do you love the Altima and Fusion? If so, are there Nissan and Ford dealers near you? I’d contact them b/c those offers are just offensive.

The dealer can’t change the RV but can increase the MF. Check Edmunds to see what the RVs are.

As @joeblogs, e-mail or call the dealers. Ask them for the lease worksheet or just ask them for MF, RV, selling price BEFORE incentives, and incentives.

Well, try not to get too tied to possible unicorn deals. Although, honestly, you could probably find leftover 3-series and 2019 C-Classes at the quotes you’ve been offered.

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I think of unicorns as exactly what they’re named after, not as guidelines. If everyone could make it happen with little effort, they wouldn’t be unicorns!

Research every detail to put the best deal possible in your circumstance together…or consider hiring a broker.

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You could try looking at dealer websites, and determine who is the internet sales manager. Email him/her directly with a stock number of the car you want. Be specific, and ask for discount, MF, RV, acq fee, doc fee, tag fee. Ask for lease quote for X miles / year for Y months, with only first month due at signing.

Repeat. Repeat. Repeat. Compare apples to apples.

Are you looking for a deal or a specific car? They’re different philosophies.

Either way, only communicate via email until you’re ready to pick up your new ride.

:bat:

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Maxima and Fusion (non-Hybrid) don’t lease well.

So, yeah, those are bad first offerss, but chances of getting a deal are slim. Look at other cars.

Also, on the Maxima deal, one problem is the dealer added $2100 in absolute garbage line items that is not reaidualized. So all that garbage that cost the dealer maybe $100 (literally a 2,100% markup) is adding $58 to your monthly. The dealer is taking $10k off the car and adding $2100 in non-residualized junk, and the end result is your spending more on the car than if they had just taken $7,900 off.

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You don’t need any of these add-ons that are included in that first quote.

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If a dealer gives me a trash quote like that I don’t even bother trying to counter . They aren’t interested in a deal or unloading a car quick. Your time is better spent with a dealer that gives a decent quote off the bat

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You are much better off looking at the Marketplace sub for Camry, Optima, Sonata and even Jetta Deals

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It’s amazing how much profit is in those items. 300 bucks for nitrogen…lol. 300 bucks for wheel locks and all weather floor mats…20 bucks on Amazon.

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But don’t forget, they’ll take off those line items and keep telling you how they’ve already reduced the price $2k, you are getting a STEAL at msrp!

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Fusions just don’t lease well. I got some quotes on Hybrids and Energis and even with over $10k in lease cash from Ford on the Energi, the lowest quotes came in at $375/mo. I’m unsure what lease cash is available currently on gas Ecoboost Fusions, but that dealer discount seems pretty paltry given they’re discontinuing the car after this model year!

My first step was to use Autotrader and Cargurus to find cars around me at dealers that I was interested in, find dealers with good prices, and then see if the prices listed included rebates/loyalty/conquest that I didn’t qualify for. Lastly, I’d go to their website to see if the prices held compared to Autotrader/Cargurus and what their website price had.

After I did all that, I would contact the dealer specifically asking if that price that I saw could be used as capitalized cost (the negotiated price) on a lease deal, excluding any incentives that I also qualified for. If they said “no, that’s a finance price” you’d have to ask their best price on the car for a lease- I found this difficult as they wanted months/miles, but I persisted and then was able to set lease terms after the fact and go through worksheets once I knew exactly what discount the car had and what rebates I qualified for.

Online is your friend most times. And if you want an amazing deal and are picky about options/colors, be willing to drive a little. I did, and am so pleased to have gotten the car in the color I wanted for a price I could love!

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Yeah, I’ve dealt with ADM junk like that on cars before by telling them to take it off the car as I’m not paying for it. If they’re serious about the sale they’ll take it off or “throw it in because we like your style”.

Low hanging fruit but i still get pleasure out of stomping on ADM as profit centers.