# Does anyone use the spreadsheet on CarBuyingTips.com? **URL:** \ **Category:** Ask the Hackrs\ **Tags:** oh\ **Created:** [March 18, 2021, 6:03pm UTC](https://forum.leasehackr.com/t/does-anyone-use-the-spreadsheet-on-carbuyingtips-com/343563 "2021-03-18T18:03:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![surbas100](https://leasehackr.b-cdn.net/letter_avatar/surbas100/32/5_5575768a8748004e209b776fc1b2916d.png) [@surbas100](https://forum.leasehackr.com/u/surbas100)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2021, 6:03pm UTC](https://forum.leasehackr.com/t/does-anyone-use-the-spreadsheet-on-carbuyingtips-com/343563/1 "2021-03-18T18:03:21Z")
Does anyone on here use the spreadsheet on [CarBuyingTips.com](http://CarBuyingTips.com) to negotiate the selling price? ![CarBuyingTips](https://leasehackr-assets.b-cdn.net/original/3X/6/5/65cf6d2d794d26b17afd436e094b72b732cc407f.jpeg) ---
**Author:** ![mllcb42](https://leasehackr.b-cdn.net/letter_avatar/mllcb42/32/5_5575768a8748004e209b776fc1b2916d.png) [@mllcb42](https://forum.leasehackr.com/u/mllcb42)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2021, 6:42pm UTC](https://forum.leasehackr.com/t/does-anyone-use-the-spreadsheet-on-carbuyingtips-com/343563/2 "2021-03-18T18:42:14Z")
No. Why would you? Holdback, invoice, how much profit over that, etc doesn’t matter. What matters is what the market is driving vehicles to actually sell for. Sometimes that’s a number that the dealer is making money on directly, sometimes it’s not. Saying “hey, I’ll give you 5% over your true (well, made up off of generalized numbers, not actually true) cost” doesn’t help you find that out at all. I’ve also seen an immense amount of incorrect information come from that site. ---
**Author:** ![forbs](https://leasehackr.b-cdn.net/letter_avatar/forbs/32/5_5575768a8748004e209b776fc1b2916d.png) [@forbs](https://forum.leasehackr.com/u/forbs)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2021, 6:42pm UTC](https://forum.leasehackr.com/t/does-anyone-use-the-spreadsheet-on-carbuyingtips-com/343563/3 "2021-03-18T18:42:45Z")
This is a leasing forum and ‘Selling Price’ is one of the ways they make money. In other words, You can negotiate 20% off but if they mark up the MF 5 times OR use US Bank instead of the captive bank to change the Residual Value, you are still boned. ---
**Author:** ![surbas100](https://leasehackr.b-cdn.net/letter_avatar/surbas100/32/5_5575768a8748004e209b776fc1b2916d.png) [@surbas100](https://forum.leasehackr.com/u/surbas100)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2021, 7:11pm UTC](https://forum.leasehackr.com/t/does-anyone-use-the-spreadsheet-on-carbuyingtips-com/343563/4 "2021-03-18T19:11:44Z")
If you already know the invoice price from a reliable source (not Edmunds, KBB, etc). and you already know the money factor and residual. Why is using a spreadsheet like this a problem? I’m a little confused. Doesn’t everyone want the best selling price, money factor and residual? ---
**Author:** ![njc](https://leasehackr.b-cdn.net/letter_avatar/njc/32/5_5575768a8748004e209b776fc1b2916d.png) [@njc](https://forum.leasehackr.com/u/njc)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2021, 7:19pm UTC](https://forum.leasehackr.com/t/does-anyone-use-the-spreadsheet-on-carbuyingtips-com/343563/5 "2021-03-18T19:19:10Z")
That site tries to convince people that they help to avoid fraud that my initial response is, wait is this fraud? Honestly don’t know anything about that site, but when the first claim is something about their CEO helping FBI combat fraud, feels like it’s being spread a little too thick right from the get go. ---
**Author:** ![mllcb42](https://leasehackr.b-cdn.net/letter_avatar/mllcb42/32/5_5575768a8748004e209b776fc1b2916d.png) [@mllcb42](https://forum.leasehackr.com/u/mllcb42)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2021, 7:37pm UTC](https://forum.leasehackr.com/t/does-anyone-use-the-spreadsheet-on-carbuyingtips-com/343563/6 "2021-03-18T19:37:52Z")
> [@surbas100](#): > > Why is using a spreadsheet like this a problem? I’m a little confused. Doesn’t everyone want the best selling price, money factor and residual? The question is “how does it help you get that?” The presumption that this spreadsheet is making is that 3-5% over true dealer cost is a good deal. It’s also using big fudge factors for things like holdback, etc, without substantiating them, but we can ignore that for the sake of discussion. So that leaves the question of “is 3-5% above cost a good deal?”. Well, on some cars, it’s impossibly good. The market conditions are such that a dealer would never do that. Further, on other cars, one can get a much better deal than that. Now, let’s throw in the mf discussion. No where in this chart is mf discussed. On some vehicles, the mf mark up may be equivalent to thousands of dollars. If you go to a dealer and get them to agree to this discount, but without that context, you may be leaving huge amounts of money on the table. Ultimately, what matters is what the market is driving. You want to look at what is actually possible based on sales data to set our target discount for that specific vehicle. ---
**Author:** ![j\_e\_f\_f](https://leasehackr.b-cdn.net/letter_avatar/j_e_f_f/32/5_5575768a8748004e209b776fc1b2916d.png) [@j\_e\_f\_f](https://forum.leasehackr.com/u/j_e_f_f)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2021, 8:01pm UTC](https://forum.leasehackr.com/t/does-anyone-use-the-spreadsheet-on-carbuyingtips-com/343563/7 "2021-03-18T20:01:36Z")
That spreadsheet just makes things way too complicated and uses all sorts of assumptions that are more likely to be wrong than right. If I was a dealer and saw something like that it would go straight in the trash. Essentially, if I’ve done my homework and know the _best_ possible deal on a given car is say 10% discount before incentives (at base MF on a lease), then that is what I will offer the dealer. I couldn’t care less what the invoice, holdback, floorplan, profit, and what not is. ---
**Author:** ![max\_g](https://leasehackr.b-cdn.net/user_avatar/forum.leasehackr.com/max_g/32/9426_2.png) [@max\_g](https://forum.leasehackr.com/u/max_g)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2021, 8:41pm UTC](https://forum.leasehackr.com/t/does-anyone-use-the-spreadsheet-on-carbuyingtips-com/343563/8 "2021-03-18T20:41:55Z")
> [@surbas100](#): > > Does anyone on here use the spreadsheet on [CarBuyingTips.com](http://CarBuyingTips.com) to negotiate the selling price This question could easily have been answered by searching the forum but here it is anyway: no, absolutely no one in the entire history of this forum has used that to negotiate the selling price. ---
**Author:** ![surbas100](https://leasehackr.b-cdn.net/letter_avatar/surbas100/32/5_5575768a8748004e209b776fc1b2916d.png) [@surbas100](https://forum.leasehackr.com/u/surbas100)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2021, 9:51pm UTC](https://forum.leasehackr.com/t/does-anyone-use-the-spreadsheet-on-carbuyingtips-com/343563/9 "2021-03-18T21:51:12Z")
Geez, rough crowd in here. It was just a simple question. I’ve only been on this forum for a few weeks. Sorry for the stupid question. ---
**Author:** ![forbs](https://leasehackr.b-cdn.net/letter_avatar/forbs/32/5_5575768a8748004e209b776fc1b2916d.png) [@forbs](https://forum.leasehackr.com/u/forbs)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2021, 10:12pm UTC](https://forum.leasehackr.com/t/does-anyone-use-the-spreadsheet-on-carbuyingtips-com/343563/10 "2021-03-18T22:12:07Z")
> [@surbas100](#): > > Geez, rough crowd in here. It usually is, but this appears to be more of ‘why is my idea not considered great’. Lots of sites out where just need the clicks and claim to have the ‘insider knowledge’ regarding secret things like holdbacks. Holdbacks are not the same for each dealer, even if the same brand. Low volume dealers get crappy holdbacks vs a high volume dealer. The only person who truly knows the holdbacks for each dealer is the dealer itself. And he probably knows that when you start spouting ‘Invoice’ or ‘Holdbacks’ that he will screw you in a different way. Get the MF, get the RV, get the current Incentives, put it in the Calculator, Look at the Payment. If that payment is too high, then start discounting it. After you get it to the point where you like the payment then go the dealer and ask for that payment. If they laugh at you or try to waste your time, ask a Broker about the deal you want, If the brokers laugh, then well you under estimated what that car will lease for. That’s about it. An easier way is to look at some brokers here and call them and ask for their price on the car you want. That gives you a better starting point then looking at clickbait websheets where you are guessing what the dealers get. ---
**Author:** ![trism](https://leasehackr.b-cdn.net/user_avatar/forum.leasehackr.com/trism/32/26973_2.png) [@trism](https://forum.leasehackr.com/u/trism)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2021, 11:36pm UTC](https://forum.leasehackr.com/t/does-anyone-use-the-spreadsheet-on-carbuyingtips-com/343563/11 "2021-03-18T23:36:15Z")
It wasn’t a stupid question at all. Half the battle in figuring out how to get the best deal is rejecting a lot of BS info that’s out there. I’m always happy to see myths get dispelled; that’s one of the valuable outputs of an open discussion. ---
**Author:** ![surbas100](https://leasehackr.b-cdn.net/letter_avatar/surbas100/32/5_5575768a8748004e209b776fc1b2916d.png) [@surbas100](https://forum.leasehackr.com/u/surbas100)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2021, 11:58pm UTC](https://forum.leasehackr.com/t/does-anyone-use-the-spreadsheet-on-carbuyingtips-com/343563/12 "2021-03-18T23:58:32Z")
I’ve been using the Lease Hacker calculator A LOT since I discovered it. It’s a great help! I struggle with trying to get the best negotiated selling price. A lot of the dealers I’ve contacted for email price quotes are not being 100% transparent, they are not giving me all the information I’m requesting. They are trying to get me to come into their dealership which I don’t want to do. ---
**Author:** ![forbs](https://leasehackr.b-cdn.net/letter_avatar/forbs/32/5_5575768a8748004e209b776fc1b2916d.png) [@forbs](https://forum.leasehackr.com/u/forbs)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2021, 12:05am UTC](https://forum.leasehackr.com/t/does-anyone-use-the-spreadsheet-on-carbuyingtips-com/343563/13 "2021-03-19T00:05:23Z")
> [@surbas100](#): > > They are trying to get me to come into their dealership which I don’t want to do. That’s why a broker is your next step. You dont pay them if you don’t like the price. Don’t pay a broker price unseen btw. ---
**Author:** ![trism](https://leasehackr.b-cdn.net/user_avatar/forum.leasehackr.com/trism/32/26973_2.png) [@trism](https://forum.leasehackr.com/u/trism)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2021, 12:13am UTC](https://forum.leasehackr.com/t/does-anyone-use-the-spreadsheet-on-carbuyingtips-com/343563/14 "2021-03-19T00:13:35Z")
The calculator is an outstanding self-service tool for sure. You’re in a stronger negotiating position if you know what the market is doing, vs. trying to nail down the dealer’s “cost” (which is more nebulous than it sounds) and then trying to reconcile that with a bunch of quotes that aren’t designed for transparency or to favor your interests. ---
**Author:** ![IAC](https://leasehackr.b-cdn.net/user_avatar/forum.leasehackr.com/iac/32/149215_2.png) [@IAC](https://forum.leasehackr.com/u/IAC)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2021, 12:33am UTC](https://forum.leasehackr.com/t/does-anyone-use-the-spreadsheet-on-carbuyingtips-com/343563/15 "2021-03-19T00:33:39Z")
Famous words: What matters is what _you_ pay. ---
**Author:** ![Qbrozen](https://leasehackr.b-cdn.net/user_avatar/forum.leasehackr.com/qbrozen/32/40846_2.png) [@Qbrozen](https://forum.leasehackr.com/u/Qbrozen)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2021, 1:07am UTC](https://forum.leasehackr.com/t/does-anyone-use-the-spreadsheet-on-carbuyingtips-com/343563/16 "2021-03-19T01:07:39Z")
> [@forbs](#): > > Get the MF, get the RV, get the current Incentives, put it in the Calculator, Look at the Payment. If that payment is too high, then start discounting it. After you get it to the point where you like the payment then go the dealer and ask for that payment. > > If they laugh at you or try to waste your time, ask a Broker about the deal you want, If the brokers laugh, then well you under estimated what that car will lease for. That’s about it. This is not a sound method. What if you like the payment but you are still leaving money on the table because it is over what a dealer would take for the car? You may like what 10% off looks like when 20% can be done. Just guessing at numbers is not effective. ---
**Author:** ![Bluemkn57cars](https://leasehackr.b-cdn.net/letter_avatar/bluemkn57cars/32/5_5575768a8748004e209b776fc1b2916d.png) [@Bluemkn57cars](https://forum.leasehackr.com/u/Bluemkn57cars)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2021, 1:07am UTC](https://forum.leasehackr.com/t/does-anyone-use-the-spreadsheet-on-carbuyingtips-com/343563/17 "2021-03-19T01:07:51Z")
> [@surbas100](#): > > A lot of the dealers I’ve contacted for email price quotes are not being 100% transparent, they are not giving me all the information I’m requesting. They are trying to get me to come into their dealership which I don’t want to do. As a customer, you don’t have to work with a dealer who is not being transparent. It is pretty easy. You make them an offer (after doing research). They can either agree to it via phone/email, they can counter, or they can say no. Dealers who still think informed customers are blindly going to walk into their dealership to negotiate, should not get your business. ---
**Author:** ![forbs](https://leasehackr.b-cdn.net/letter_avatar/forbs/32/5_5575768a8748004e209b776fc1b2916d.png) [@forbs](https://forum.leasehackr.com/u/forbs)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2021, 2:42pm UTC](https://forum.leasehackr.com/t/does-anyone-use-the-spreadsheet-on-carbuyingtips-com/343563/18 "2021-03-19T14:42:44Z")
> [@Qbrozen](#): > > Just guessing at numbers is not effective. I suggested this because he was going to a website and ‘guessing’ their holdback. Using the LH Calculator will give him a much better idea of what to pay per month compared to saying your cost is $XXX, so what’s my payment. That’s why later I said just go to a broker. Then he has a good idea of what a ‘starter’ monthly payment is , and not just ‘your holdback is 3%, give me a better deal’. ---
**Author:** ![system](https://leasehackr-assets.b-cdn.net/original/3X/f/7/f76e5433b417879e07ad6f0cee47e239c8f1cdd4.png) [@system](https://forum.leasehackr.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2021, 2:42pm UTC](https://forum.leasehackr.com/t/does-anyone-use-the-spreadsheet-on-carbuyingtips-com/343563/19 "2021-05-18T14:42:49Z")
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