As long as it is stated in their ad that it includes taxes and fees for your state/city.
If not, then do this 
.
No need to assume anything. Single pay contracts are very clear. I have seen single pay agreements where taxes and other fees were capitalized which is very foolish as they will incur a finance charge. But this is much different than adding fees to the one pay and then, calling it the total one pay.
Then the broker is wrong. Calling the total amount due as the one-pay amount is patently false and clearly misleading.
Thatâs exactly the way it should be. So, there are separate line items for each fee charged including the one payâŚ
one pay (NP) âŚ
taxesâŚ
Acq feeâŚ
Doc feesâŚ
Gov feesâŚ
TOTAL⌠xxxxx.oo
xxxxx.oo ainât the total one-pay amount. There is no such thing as a total one-pay amount. Its equal to NP. No total amount here unless you want to add the discounted monthly payment N times!
Again, read the OPâs 2nd question in his/her 1st post.
Theory and practice are not the same thing. Doesnât matter if thatâs the way it should be, that isnât the way it is in common practice.
What youâre saying is correct in the context of the actual contract but it is not how things are generally discussed, which is what is relevant to the question at hand.
Ah, yes, it is.
And thatâs exactly how it should be! You just contradicted yourself. Iâm talking about the only thing that matters⌠the lease contract. What Iâm describing is exactly what you would see in a lease contract. I donât give one hoot of whatâs being discussed unless itâs a significant departure from what one would see in the contract. Then I make a good faith effort to correct it.
Again, OP askedâŚ
This is a very good question, and I can see why the OP might ask such a question. And I answered it within the context of the way a lease contract is constructed in that regard which is the way it should be.
Again, stop the spinning b/c you look very foolish to those that know better. But, as most of us know, youâre not a foolish man. In fact, youâre very bright. So, please, do yourself a favor and stop the non-sense.
WHOA! I am saying literally that because again, if you read what I saidâŚ
Because obviously youâre quoting with tax if youâre specifying a state. What would be the point of saying which state if youâre not including taxes?
I do it, other brokers do it, there are PLENTY of examples on this forum of brokers advertising one-payâs that are the final number PLUS just their broker fee on top. That is literally what Iâm saying.
Again, he asked:
But in the context ofâŚ
On what planet is it misleading if a broker quotes a deal as â$6,000 one-payâ and the customer goes into the dealership and pays $6,000 and leaves with a contracted one-pay lease?
Are you actually trying to tell me thatâs misleading because itâs technically, for example, $5,000 in payments and $1,000 in upfront fees?
I donât have a problem with that as long as it is a contractual one-pay lease for which the one-pay = 6,000 and NOT 6000 + 2000 worth of fees or 8,000 and calling the 8000 the one-pay or total one-pay. Thatâs misleading b/c 8000 is NOT the one-pay, 6000 is the one pay and that would be clearly identified in the contract. Go pull a one-pay lease contract and see what it says.
I think youâre overreaching. The OP question is a stand-alone question. OP asked for the nth timeâŚ
See the word âAlsoâ? Itâs not a contextual issue. This question has nothing to do with the previous two questions asked. Also means something in addition to what has already been mentioned or occurred previously.
Again, the one-pay is just one part (line item) of the total amount due at signing. Iâll repeat what I posted earlierâŚ
one pay (NP) âŚ
taxesâŚ
Acq feeâŚ
Doc feesâŚ
Gov feesâŚ
TOTAL⌠xxxxx.oo
xxxxx.oo ainât the total one-pay amount or, the one-pay. Itâs the total amount due at signing that includes the one-pay amount. There is no such thing as a total one-pay amount. One-pay = NP. Period. Calling the total amount due at signing the one-pay amount is misleading unless there are no other upfront fees involved. Thatâs all Iâm saying.
EDIT: OP never mentions one-pay in his/her first two questionsâŚ
The issue of one pay doesnât arise until third questionâŚ
This is separate and distinct from the previous two questions asked. Take this to an English or linguistics professor and Iâm sure theyâll agree.
Weâre being less technical than you.
Whatâs easier, quoting âOne pay lease, $3,300 in payment + $500 doc fee + $350 plates/reg plus $800 taxesâ or just saying " $4,950 one pay for a New Jersey customer"
Yes a one pay is obviously comprised of multiple things, but there is no broker on here that I could imagine who would say â$6,000 one pay for an NJ customerâ and then magically all the taxes and fees get added on top. That would make no sense.
Iâm good, professors seem to be great at being extremely literal and making things more difficult than they have to be.
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Why not just say that the total amount due at signing is 8000 and, of that amount, 6000 is the one pay amount. The remaining 2000 covers taxes, doc fee, acquisition fee, etc. Seems very simple and straight-forward to me.
If you told me the one-pay is 8000 and then, I looked at the contract which states the one-pay is 6000, that would trigger some question b/c you obviously are telling me something that contradicts what the contract says. What gives?
Say it correctly. Remember, that the one pay is used to compute the adjusted lease balance in the event the lessee terminates early. If the lease goes full term, then the initial lease balance converges to the residual at the discounted lease interest rate. The initial lease balance is just the difference between the adj. cap and the one-pay amount.
Thatâs a great plan and technically correct. No one does that when speaking in general terms. Youâre not going to single handedly change the lexicon.
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Iâm a firm believer in mean what you say and say what you mean. Youâre right, Iâm not going to change the lexicon of others. I can only strive to communicate correctly and not worry about how others communicate.
Unfortunately, by communicating it in this way, youâve given information to the person asking that is technically correct and practically wrong to the tune of several thousand dollars.
Im all for being pendantic if you accompany it with the practical reality.
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Nothing wrong about it. Either itâs right or wrong. There is not technically correct and practically incorrect. Thatâs bs. Interesting how you try to manipulate and turn things around.
Again, what is wrong withâŚ
Looks spot on to me and easy to understand both technically and as a matter of practicality unless youâre a moron.
I think you would have a very promising career in politics or as a lobbyist. Iâm through arguing with you. I might as well go outside and argue with my pine trees. Waste of time.
Fine, we can simplify this then.
If question is âif i am reading the contract, and come across the line item that specifies âsingle paymentâ, does that include taxes and fees?â, the answer is no unless theyâre capitalized, as is sometimes done.
If the question is âI am talking to a dealer/broker about doing a single pay lease, are taxes and fees generally included in that single payment?â, the answer is yes.
One is correct contractually. One is correct with how business is actually done.
We can leave it to the original posted to determine if they were asking the practical realities of how business is done or if they were asking about the specifics of how the contract is written.
Why not just say that itâs an $8,000 single payment lease? Whatâs false about that?
Is the dealer going to the bill the $6,000 and the $2,000 separately? Or are they going to take a check for $8,000 and call it a day?
Who is the governing body that decides that the term âone-payâ means what you say it means? Thatâs all this is, you believe that I cannot use the term âone-payâ and simply say a single amount, or that it would not be correct to refer to a âone-payâ as the single net amount paid to the dealer because itâs technically X + Y = Z instead of just saying Z.
If I told you a deal was an $8,000 one pay, all in, and was clearly quoted for you and your state specifically, youâd have a problem if it was technically $6,000 in payments and $2,000 in taxes and fees?
This is a distinction without a differenceâŚ
In your mind, it seems that $8,000 one pay does not equal $6,000 in payments + $2,000 in upfront taxes and fees paid all at once. Evidently these are two different things to you.
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Are you kidding me? And youâre s broker? The 8000 is NOT the single pay amount as I explained in my post above. Did you read it? What is that you donât understand about paying the entire 8000 (DAS) of which, 6000 is the one pay amount? The 8000 is the DAS and thatâs a much different concept than the single pay.
The governing body is mathematics. The one pay is a mathematically calculated number. For MF leases, itâs NP as I have repeated many times. I donât agree with it, and I donât decide as it is an industry standard for MF leases. Why donât you call GMF, American Honda Finance, Kia Financial, or any of the other captives and have them explain it. Just by your asking such a question shows that you donât understand the structure of one-pays and the math involved. For MF leases, itâs very simple. For interest rate leases, like FMC, itâs much more complex.
AGAINâŚ
xxxxx.oo is the total amount due at signing of which, part of it is the one-pay amount.
The single pay or one pay are triggering terms. I would suggest that you refer to the Federal Reserve Boardâs Regulation M⌠Consumer Leasing Act (CLA).
Merry XMAS!
You keep ignoring the part where I acknowledge that LITERALLY SPEAKING the total amount of money paid on a one-pay lease is comprised of multiple things to make a net total amount, the point, that you are ignoring just to mess with me, or truly donât comprehend, is that to a NORMAL PERSON there is no difference between saying â$8,000 one-payâ or â$6,000 one pay + $925 acq +499 doc + 576 taxesâ
Itâs still a single payment of $8,000.
By your logic, if I advertise a car priced for New Jersey, I should be listing it at base payment + tax instead of just saying what the final payment is with tax, itâs effectively the same thing.
I SIMPLY REFUSE to believe you are this dense.
You clearly understand the point Iâm making but as youâve shown time and time again you focus on being extremely technical, I donât even want to say technically correct, because youâre not.
Again, there is no governing body that decides what the term âone-payâ means, itâs just two words.
Just so all the normal people her can understand what @delta737h is being so pedantic about, this is a sample one pay lease contract breakdown:
Heâs essentially saying it would be questionable and dishonest to say advertise a one pay lease as â24,181.51 one pay leaseâ because itâs technically â$20,268.96 one pay lease plus taxes and fees for a total amount of $24,181.51â
Again, a distinction without a difference, since âone-pay leaseâ isnât some kind of legally defined term.
So yes, @delta737h I do UNDERSTAND what youâre saying, but youâre just being ridiculous to suggest there is some important distinction here assuming it was disclosed that your one pay was all inclusive, which generally, is understood when someone advertises a one-pay⌠or if not, they would say + taxes.
Itâs just obviously implied that if a customer asks for a one-pay amount, youâd be quoting them a complete number with all taxes and fees factored.
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If we want to be super-duper pedantic, the contract defines what the âsingle paymentâ amount is, not what a â1 payâ consists of. An English or linguistics professor would agree that those are, in fact, different words.
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Youâre not going to change Deltaâs mind. Donât bother.
Literally every other person on LH understands what we mean by onepay and we can move forward with that.
That being said, my advice/answer to the OPâs question remains the same.
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