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What happens if BMW detects the tune and voids the warranty? What would happen at lease trade in? Obviously they canāt certify it, etc - how will that affect the return? I assume it would be an issue since it was driven out of spec for a long time and BMW wonāt want it back (if they detect the tune, which they can easily do now as itās automated.)
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You are thinking too deeply.
Donāt be a d*ck to your SA and most service departments wonāt care.
Assuming op went with a reputable tuner everything should be fine butā¦ thereās always a risk.
You are more likely to be fixing something that broke on the car than bmw Detecting the tune and denying the lease turn in (know dozens of people with tuned bmws who turned in with no issue)
Personally I would think about returning it to stock at turn in but thatās just to cover myself.
Even a piggyback tune can be detected if they look at the data logs to determine what went wrong with your car.
If you donāt feel safe with a tune donāt pick up the transfer but if I were any of you I would.
Heās essentially giving you m5 power at an m550 price.
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Yeah, thatās not how things work. Itās not about āthinking too deeplyā, itās about protecting the person who takes over the lease from the consequences of a tune that they didnāt know existed. The ādozens of peopleā you know may not have had issues and therefore did not have to deal with consequences. I āknowā hundreds of people who had their warranties (and claims) voided because of a tune.
Itās 2021. You can be the nicest guy to the SA, but the SA does not have much of a say when the engine blows and BMW decide to send in an expert tech to look into what caused it. There are numerous threads about people having their powertrain warranties voided becuase of a tune (or simple piggy back!)
The question is simple and not overthinking - what happens in the cases when a leased car that has a known tune gets returned to BMW where the warranty was voided? I would also like to know in case I ever get a tune and if there are costs/fees associated with returning a car that has a voided powertrain warranty. Does the car need to be bought out at the end of the lease?
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Yup. Even the GM has almost no pull if BMWNA decides to void it.
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Anybody know the the consequences if BMW discovers the tune at, or before, turn in?
I would be very interested if I knew there would be no issues going forward.
That was exactly my question as well. It seems like there are a lot of āifs and butsā answers, but not a clear answer really yet. I would think there would be some sort of penalty as BMW would not be able to certify the car anymore (if they wanted to.)
You completely took everything I said and twisted it in a way that suits your prerogative.
DONT TAKE THE CAR IF YOU ARE SCARED ITāS TUNED
Seriously, you are lucky he even disclosed it, he could have not said anything and left you completely in the dark.
He disclosed the tune, he explained it can be reflashed for stock, do your own research on tunes, heās not gonna spoon feed you every single possibility or risks and nobody can tell you the percentages of failures in tunes, etc etc
Guess I gotta spoonfeed here, SA can flag that sht if they really wanna fck you over, if your tune causes an issue then nobody can help you and you are S.O.L.
Then you just made a bunch of useless posts, you know the risks, live with it or donātā¦ heās not forcing the car upon you lol.
This is a completely different question than what you asked in the first place.
In order to get your warranty voided they either flag itā¦ again if your dealership is a stickler or you are a d*ck to your SA, or something goes wrong with the car that is catastrophic and you try to get it repaired within warranty.
Donāt get a tune, you are already thinking too hard and are scared of the risk, itās not worthwhile for you to even think about it. Read your own words below.
Case and point, you did your research.
The dozens of people I know have been tuning since the bush era in presidency and have gone through M cars where some of the tunes were borderline pushing it but the tuners were reputable and nothing happen, every car is different, every tune is different, it really depends on your luck and how aggressive the tune is and how you drive it.
Tl;dr
Get a tune or donāt get a tune. Iām pretty sure bmw isnāt running around with obd II scanners and pulling ecuās on every single lease turn in they get.
Again, you are for some reason on a mission to get this deal moving. I didnāt even read your response as you took my question out of context started to give a vague response as opposed to responding to the specific question that was asked.
He obviously disclosed it. That wasnāt the question. The question is (which others have asked as well), what would happen if BMW was to void warranty because of the tune? Saying ādozes of people have returned it without an issueā is not an answer as that doesnāt mean that BMW knew thereās a tune. You are also talking about agressiveness of tunes, which is not even the point of the debate. BMW does not check how agressive your tune is before they decide to void a warranty.
They would flag it no matter how āagressiveā the tune is if they found out about it which caused a substantial claim. No SA will be able to save you as you stated before - BMWNA will send their own tech with a substantial claim and request a readout of all the flags on the car.
Please donāt respond if you donāt know the answer as you are getting off topic.
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Iām going to explain this one more time, maybe I got too technical on you.
The more aggressive a tune no matter who the tuner is the more stress you put on the car, the more stress you put on the car the more likely something is to break. Especially when you donāt upgrade corresponding parts, Iāll spare you examples they can get complicated.
Something breaks you take it to the dealer and they then go through the works Diagnosing and tearing the car apart to find out what went wrong. Stop #1 is the ecu, they will find any piggyback or flashed tune regardless of if you went back to stock. Right there your warranty claim is denied, you warranty is probably over and your vin is flagged. I have never heard of anyone with a flagged vin having issues on lease turn inā¦ again your experiences may vary.
When you take your car in for a normal service they arenāt looking to flag your vin, obviously if they detect something they can but most just donāt care to go through the paperworkā¦ again unless you were a d*ck to your SA, dealership is a stickler, etc etc
So far nobody has had any issues, I talked to guys at dme who tune a ridiculous amount of M cars and some are leased, they say no issues.
The dealer has an option to buy your lease via bmw FS, if they know they canāt cpo it or the margins arenāt there or the car isnāt clean, needs tires, etc etc it will get sent to auction.
So no bmw doesnāt care if they can cpo it or not and you arenāt dealing with the dealer you are dealing with BMW FS.
You are taking this topic in all different directions my friend, first you say ask what happens at lease turn in then you assume it will be an issue, my first response was pretty self explanatory. Then you tell us you know dozens of people who had warranty work denied due to tunes, etc etc.
If the question you are asking is if you will have issues at turn in then the answer is No, but policies change constantly.
Because this thread isnāt the best place to start a discussion on tunes the risks associated with tunes and any issues you might encounter along the way on a lease transfer thread.
Honestly a TH should move this all to a new thread if it isnāt regarding this car, or maybe the landfill police can do it.
14 posts were merged into an existing topic: Off Topic Landfill 5
Please keep this thread on track. Left the tune information as both individuals presented valid points and applies to this car that is leased and tuned.
As a more helpful note; @Da_Do83 , it ultimately should not matter to the leasee what BMWNA does with the car that was reflashed back to stock on trade-in. Most lease contracts Iāve seen (all, this is anecdotal to me) stipulate the car must be turned in as it was delivered to the leasee.
I read that as the car (minus consumables such as tires and brakes) must be returned with the original manufacturer/dealer-installed parts at lease turn-in and the condition of the car would be evaluated based on that.
BMWNA and dealers have the full capability to see a reflashed ECU or replaced ECU and will absolutely deny warranty work if the warranty is being used for engine/powertrain issues. This is not the leaseeās problem if it gets turned in and someone else buys it.
The car should effectivey be sold āas-isā and will most likely be a perfect candidate for BMWNA to send straight to auction as I donāt see them supporting a CPO warranty on it.
Lifting slow mode to give a chance to be civil again.
So hereās a hypothetical scenario. This is not specific to this thread, but Iām generally curious what happens as I have tuned every single BMW Iāve owned.
- I lease a car
- I tune my car and the engine blows after 30k miles and 6 months left on the lease
- I tune the car back to stock
- BMW denies warranty claim due to suspected tune with a $25k bill.
- Is the leasee obligated to repair the car before turning it in with 6 months left?
This is the reason why Iām asking - the owner can tune the car back to stock but BMW can see if it was EVER tuned. If original leasee tunes it back to stock and the person taking over the lease blows the engine while being stock, BMW can still see that the car had been tune and would flag it.
Iām not looking for an answer that itās āunlikelyā, but Iām looking for a genuinely accurate response without āit depends on your SAā because in this scenario no SA can save you since the systems are automated to look for tunes.
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You break it you buy it, basically you are expected to turn the car in with normal wear and tear.
Hence my warning that things can happen, no matter how safe a tune is you should be prepared. Iām 100% confident in reputable tuners that Donāt tune the car to the max but you must understand increased performance = increased stress on the car.
Yeah aka you are fked, you took over the lease you took over the risk knowing it was tuned since it was disclosed. Now if not disclosed lawyers would probably be my suggestion if you did not know and you basically were in the dark.
Thereās a bunch of questions here being ask which is why SA came up.
To make it long story short.
Will bmw care if I turn my lease in that has been tuned?
Most likely not, recommendation would be to flash the car back to stock to avoid any issues.
Will bmw care if I turn my DAMAGED lease that has been tuned?
Yes, you are expected to turn the vehicle in with normal wear and tear, a spun rod bearing, or bent rods are not normal wear and tear. You will be on the hook for an engine rebuild, probably best not to tell BMW either as that could further complicate things as per your contract.
Basically the risk is on you, Iām not going to make any recommendations here as it is a transfer thread and Iām not here to sh*t on tuned transfers, but this is definitely good knowledge for those looking to tune and should be discussed in a separate thread.
Just stay away from any of these ātunedā cars. Itās like getting a cat in the bag that can bite you at any moment. People that get these tunes tend to push it thinking they know better then engineers at the factory.
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In most cases Iād agree, but the m550 engine is the exact same one in the m cars, yes the exact parts may differ but the engine is more than capable of the power
Personally I wouldnāt take that gamble